Transcript - ABC Afternoon Briefing - 12 November 2025

Melissa McIntosh MP 
Shadow Minister for Communications 
Shadow Minister for Women 
Federal Member for Lindsay 

12 November 2025 

Transcript 

ABC Afternoon Briefing with Patricia Karvelas

Topics: Net zero.

E&EO … 

Patricia Karvelas

Melissa McIntosh is the Shadow Communications Minister and has been championing the cause of dumping net zero. She says it's what her electorate wants, especially on power prices. She's just walked out of the meeting. Fresh, live with us. Melissa McIntosh, welcome.

Melissa McIntosh

No, there's no freshness.

Karvelas

OK.

McIntosh

Yeah, it was a - we almost had a five hour party room, but very worthwhile to do.

Karvelas

Five hours, ok, well, we should have prepared a milkshake or something for you to help you recover. We hear there were 28 voices, MPs, against net zero being used, kept as a policy. Is that about right? Is that your assessment? I know you can't tell me everything that happened …

McIntosh

Yeah.

Karvelas

But was the majority against net zero?

McIntosh

I know you've got Dan Tehan coming on to your show shortly, but I will say a couple of things. The first is that, I think, there was consistency in the room. I certainly stood up for my community and it's not about climate ideology. People are really suffering, and I've said this to you before, and expressed what they asked me to express and people from the party room did the same thing. That's why it went for so long.

The settlement on net zero isn't going to happen today. We still have another couple of processes. It will go to Shadow Cabinet tomorrow morning and then of course, we've got a meeting, a full Coalition meeting on Sunday. And we also have three designated members from the Liberal Party and three from The Nats that will come together and discuss. So, this is a first step in the process. I can't declare a final position yet, but there were very much consistencies in the room.

Affordability of energy was pretty much number one for a lot of people. Certainly, for my community, people are struggling like they've never struggled before and they rated that as the top issue and the top issue they want us. People did talk inconsistency about the need for us to have action on bringing down emissions and our global responsibility. So, I think there's pretty much an agreement that we stay in Paris and we had, you know, there was more agreements. You might be surprised. I know you probably all thought we'd come out, and our elbows were sharp and there was a lot more agreement in the room than disagreements.

Karvelas

Okay, but you would agree and you're right, Dan Tehan will tell us in a moment, but just the majority were against net zero by 2050 being.

McIntosh

Well, yeah, there was certainly - it felt like in the room there was more people in agreement than against and I think you probably know already who those people are. So I feel strong and confident that we are going to land in a good place. And, you know, the best I could do was prosecute the argument for my community, Western Sydney, people that are aspirational, doing their best, but struggling under Labor's renewables-only approach and this target that, you know, I've said it before, Labor aren't going to achieve it. They're missing their targets on emissions reduction, they're missing the housing targets, they're breaking promises to Australians. We need to start prosecuting that and being a strong Opposition.

Karvelas

So, was there any compromise so that people in the metropolitan areas, not seats like you, but seats like Tim Wilson's, which he obviously had to fight very hard to get back, to be able to use the language of net zero, or is it dead and buried?

McIntosh

Today was an opportunity for individuals to stand up and have their say. We had up to five minutes each to really prosecute our case and our arguments and our feelings and represent our communities. There wasn't any further discussion about negotiations or what might happen next. That will be up to Dan to lead with Sussan and for us to discuss as the Shadow Cabinet tomorrow morning.

Karvelas

Now, obviously, Scott Morrison signed Australia up to net zero by 2050. So, do you concede that this is a pretty significant backdown from what the party had agreed to on behalf of Australia?

McIntosh

I think the world's a changing place since that time. I was a baby MP back in that time, and my recollection is we didn't have the discussion or, you know, the option to stand up and have our say. It was something that was decided by leadership. So today I really value that we've gone through this process and I have been able to go out to my community and I have been able to, as I promised, talk about my position, their position in the public space. That didn't happen back then and the world has moved on. People are struggling now with energy prices. We can't keep on this trajectory. We need to change. We're not going to have a different outcome if we don't do something different.

Karvelas

So, you know, you talk about your community and power prices, and I think people know that power prices are high and it's pretty difficult to deal with. But I know your community pretty well, too. You've shown me around as well. And your community deals with kind of unspeakable heat in summer and very difficult conditions, too. I mean, climate change really affects people in Western Sydney really, really significantly.

McIntosh

Yeah, and there's unity in the party room that we do need to be focused on climate change and we do need to bring down emissions. This was purely about a discussion around these unachievable targets that we've been locked into and that net zero is by 2050 is not working for Australians.

And people in my community do want to do the right thing. The solar panels are on their roofs and they can't afford the batteries. And we care about our local environment. We've got a beautiful Nepean River running through it. So, we care about the environment. We're not anti-environment. We are pro-reality. And the reality is that people are struggling like they've never struggled before.

And as an Opposition, once we settle on this, we'll be able to take that case and really, you know, show the weakness in Labor's policies and stand up for the Australian people against this abhorrent target.

Karvelas

Okay, Andrew Hirst is the Liberal Party director. He came into your meeting, as you know, you were there, I wasn't, but I know about it. He came in and talked about the research, and he said that the words net zero are linked to the idea of taking climate action. I mean, that's a warning, isn't it, from your director that those things are linked for so many voters.

McIntosh

Who leaked that to you, PK? I don't know. It's a lot of - you probably know more, more about it before I even stepped out. I think it was important for us to go through the research part of it with the director of the Liberal Party and the research on people who are regarded as swinging voters.

But people have, you know, preconceived ideas and they can change those ideas. And it is up to us as a party of government to be able to convince the Australians that our path forward is going to be the right path forward for them and that we are looking at wanting to look after them, their best interests.

That we, I think – I still think we should have a short term and medium term and a long term energy policy. Dan obviously will be leading that and we should be looking at things like dropping the ban on nuclear power. My community wants that something that, and I won't - I don't think it's breaking any confidences here, but we did discuss about Australia's, you know,  opportunities for our nation in the future and the fact that if we have AI coming, which it is, and we want to have our data stored here in Australia, not offshore, and so many Australians are concerned about that, we need to be able to power that in the future. It can't just be off the local energy grid, which it is right now. That is just not sustainable. So, for us to be prosperous as a country in the future, to be taking those opportunities, we need to be also looking at other alternative power options, like nuclear.

Karvelas

But there is a perception, though, and that's what Andrew Hirst is really referring to, a perception about that. And it clearly has hurt the Liberals for a long time in metropolitan cities like Sydney and Melbourne, where you've lost a swathe of seats. Can you see the electoral risk here?

McIntosh

We did have net zero, as you reminded me, it was under Prime Minister Morrison, and we did that. We had that as a policy at the previous election. So that argument that, you know, that we're going to lose further trust amongst Australians about our climate credentials, well, it's going to be up to us to, to turn that around, if that is the case, to convince the Australian public that we are the, you know, we are the party of choice that we do care about. We do want to play our part from an international perspective. We do want to bring down emissions. We're just going to do it, you know, that's my argument, we just got to do it in a different way. And I think that's really important.

Karvelas

Yeah.

McIntosh

Lift, you know - lift the weight that this 2050 target is pushing on us and pushing on Australians who can't pay the bills.

Karvelas

So, just to be clear, and I know Dan Tehan’s about to speak, we're going to go to that press conference any moment now. But we appreciate your time as a frontbencher, Melissa McIntosh, to give us, you know, your perspective coming out of that meeting. Does that mean you - do you want to reach net zero ever?

McIntosh

Sorry, what was it you just cut out?

Karvelas

Do you still want to reach net zero? Like, is it still an aspiration?

McIntosh

Well, for me, and we still, as I said, we've still got to go through Shadow Cabinet - for me, we can't be talking about net zero. We do have a role to play internationally. I think we should stay in Paris. I think there was, you know, quite a strong consistency in the party room, that that should be the way forward. But that target, and, you know, we're not reaching that, Patricia. Labor is not reaching its emissions reduction target. So, for the pressure on Australians for it to be renewables only decimating, you know, our natural environment in the regions, you know, and people in the suburbs, like where I am, are paying the price, well, that's just not right and that's not fair. So, it's not a question around our role as citizens in the world, in the global perspective, it's around this particularly this unfair target that's putting so much pressure on Australians.

Karvelas

How about Sussan Ley's leadership? Sussan Ley was under a lot of pressure. I saw a big group of conservative MPs walking in right at the front of the pack. There was Sarah Henderson, who said basically that her support was, you know, eroding in the party, yet she was front and centre of this conservative pack. Is Sussan Ley safe?

McIntosh

If people felt that way before, I hope that they have shifted a little bit now. As I said, I don't think - and colleagues, you know, said it to me in the party room, it's not a normal thing to have so much consultation. I think it was a really good process to go through and despite what the media might think, there was nothing but, like, quite a strong consistency and agreement within the party room. It did take a long time because we all got to have a say and Sussan told the Australian public what she would do and that was consultation and going through this process and that's exactly what she has done. So, I don't think today was anything but a positive thing, and it felt like that in the party room.

Karvelas

So, if net zero is poised to be dumped, which clearly, because the majority we know in the Liberal Party room today we can reveal were opposed to net zero by 2050 remaining Liberal Party policy, does that mean that The Nationals and the Liberals will stay together? Because it's essentially a very similar policy.

McIntosh

I love The Nats. So, they're good. They’re, you know, a good part of the family. I'm a Coalitionist. I sit next to David Littleproud in Question Time. I work very closely with Anne Webster. We've been, you know, really pushing hard against what the government's been doing on the Triple Zero outages. So, I think it's really important for us to stay together with the National Party as a Coalition. I think that's when we are strongest. And I think we do need to show the Australian people we can be a strong Opposition, holding the government to account. Because right now, when we're, you know, when we haven't been - they're getting away with too much. Missing housing targets, missing every - all their targets and breaking promises. And while we're in disarray, we can't be a strong Opposition. So, staying with The Nationals would be a really good outcome for us and I'm feeling positive about that.

Karvelas

Thank you so much.