Transcript - ABC 7.30 - 8 October 2025

Melissa McIntosh MP
Shadow Minister for Communications
Shadow Minister for Women
Federal Member for Lindsay

8 October 2025

Transcript

ABC 7.30 with Sarah Ferguson

Topics: Triple Zero outage; Triple Zero inquiry; Optus; ACMA; NBN; critical infrastructure.

E&EO …

Sarah Ferguson

Soon after discovering its Triple Zero outage, Optus sent two emails to the Communications Department reporting the problem. However, those emails were sent to the wrong address. The communications regulator, ACMA, and Government department officials appeared in Senate Estimates today, while questions continued to be asked about what the Communications Minister, Anika Wells, knew and when.

Melissa McIntosh is the Shadow Minister for Communications. Melissa McIntosh, welcome to 7.30.

Melissa McIntosh

Thank you.

Ferguson

On Optus, first, before the politics, now, their outage was undetected for 13 hours. They misled the regulator about the scale of the outage, they sent emails to the wrong email address. And that's just. At the very least, should the CEO of Optus resign?

McIntosh

It's a debacle and people died. I said very early on, when the CEO came out in front of the Australian public without enough answers that Australians were losing confidence in the Triple Zero network and they were losing confidence in the CEO. I've been asking for a meeting with the CEO and he even came to Parliament.

Yet it took media attention for him to finally say he would meet with me. And I look forward to that because I have a lot of questions and I have a lot of questions of the government. As you said in your opening, ACMA knew about it, the Department of Communications and the Minister's office.

Yet there still seems to be a lot of confusion about this email that was meant to alert everyone of a Triple zero outage. Our most essential communications service went down for hundreds of people and as we know, people did die.

Ferguson

Now, when you do meet with the CEO of Optus, what will you be demanding of him, principally? And if I can come back to that previous question, do you think he should resign?

McIntosh

I think Optus has a lot of explaining to do and as far as I can see, they're willing to cooperate with the government and the legislation. That's another story: the government's legislation that has been rushed through. I think Australians would probably either want him to step up more than he has done. He promised to face the Australian public every single day until this was sorted, and yet I don't believe he has done that. So if he can't front the Australian public and create confidence as we're approaching disaster season, then I think ultimately he probably has to consider his position.

Ferguson

Is there something wrong, do you think, Melissa McIntosh, in the culture at Optus, that they are unable to come clean after failings? This isn't the first time they've had major crises with serious consequences in their business.

McIntosh

Sarah, can I take this up another level? I think there's actually something seriously wrong with our whole Triple Zero network, it's not only Optus that has had an outage. NBN had faults that caused an outage as well during this time. And we have government regulation that just doesn't seem to be working. The telecommunications industry is the most regulated industry. Yet, we have had fault after fault. What is going on?

And that's why I've been calling for a thorough independent investigation, not just into Optus, into the whole Triple Zero network. And I think it can't be ACMA, the regulator, because as you said, ACMA received an email. How can ACMA investigate themselves as a regulator when they are part of the failed process?

Ferguson

Let me just ask you this, because Independent MP Helen Haines, who's followed the issue of the Triple Zero system for some time, she said today that we don't need another inquiry. There's been plenty of inquiries. The principal question is around enforcement, which is also - you're talking about the weakness of enforcement. Is Helen Haines right that more inquiries will soak up too much time and what we need to do is to make the current legislation more effective?

McIntosh

I certainly don't think we need another government run inquiry. We had an inquiry after the outage by Optus in 2023 when there were recommendations made. The government has been sitting on these recommendations for a year and a half. It took them a year and a half and a disastrous outage for them to act and for them to rush through legislation in the last weeks of Parliament.

And you know, I agree with Helen in some respects and that's why I put through amendments today to that legislation to try and strengthen it. We had no time - 24 hours. And what I'm calling for is a number of things to strengthen that legislation. Like having a register every time there is an Optus outage so Australians have transparency and can see where those outages are to list this as critical infrastructure. So there is more.

Ferguson

Just on that question, if I may, Melissa McIntosh.

McIntosh

Yeah.

Ferguson

Telecoms networks are listed as critical infrastructure under the Security of Critical Infrastructure Act. So why do you need to change that?

McIntosh

The Triple Zero network specifically. And that will cover off things like cybersecurity and have more oversight. Something, you know what Sarah, as I said to you, we've had 24 hours notice, I have one staff member. The government has the forces of a department can't get an email read and we're doing everything we can to help.

Why shouldn't we be looking at this as an option? Why shouldn't we be looking at increasing the fines to telcos? We are calling for that doubling.

Ferguson

Your point about the fines lands. I'm still confused about why you need to change the Act because telecommunications networks are already listed as critical infrastructure.

McIntosh

Specifically the Triple Zero network. So that we can have assurances. Because Australians are losing confidence that they can call Triple Zero in their greatest time of need.

Ferguson

Let me just put it.

McIntosh

Things aren’t working the way they are, Sarah.

Ferguson

Let me just put to you what something that Anika Wells said today. She said that until Labor acted, telcos weren't legally required to report outages. So if this is so obvious to you now that this is what is required, why didn't the government, the Liberal government, act when it was in power?

McIntosh

Why did the government sit on recommendations for a year and a half and four people have passed away for them to act and implement what was right in front of them all the time to then rush through legislation? Why has there been a custodian sitting in the Department of Communication that we found out just this week has been there since March? What have they been doing since March? What were they doing during this devastating outage? There are so many questions of the government specifically about this outage and to ensure Australians that this is not going to happen again. This is why I am pushing this so hard. This should not be happening. Every one of your listeners, people that are watching this show should be able to pick up their phone and call Triple Zero in their greatest time of need. We should at least be giving them that.

Ferguson

I think everyone would answer that with a resounding yes. Just a question on the politics here. Does the internal wrangling inside your own party zap your authority when it comes to challenging the government?

McIntosh

I decide, and I'm going to speak honestly to you, to try and switch off from any of that stuff and focus on what we are meant to be doing as an Opposition. And that's what I've been trying to do, along with my colleagues, over the last couple of weeks and holding the government to account.

Australians want us to be a strong Opposition. If we weren't prosecuting this issue over the last couple of weeks, the government would be getting off that. We wouldn't be rushing legislation through, we wouldn't be holding Optus to account, we wouldn't be having a Senate inquiry and the senators asking today about these emails that no one seemed to be able to look at and open. What happened there?

So I think we do need to focus on the jobs that Australians do want us to do and to be a strong Opposition and to put everything else aside, and I'm certainly focused on that.

Ferguson

Melissa McIntosh, I'd like you to keep us up to date on what happens when you do get to meet the CEO, Stephen Rue of Optus tomorrow. In the meantime, thank you very much indeed for joining us.

McIntosh

Thank you, Sarah.

Ferguson

Thank you.