Transcript - 2SM Breakfast - 3 November 2025

Melissa McIntosh MP 
Shadow Minister for Communications 
Shadow Minister for Women 
Federal Member for Lindsay 

3 November 2025 

Transcript 

2SM Breakfast with Tim Webster

Topics: Optus inquiry; Triple Zero; ACMA; Starlink; NBN.

E&EO … 

Webster

Opposition communications spokeswoman Melissa McIntosh, or a Smithy says our Penrith Polly joins us on the line now. G'day.

McIntosh

Good morning.

Webster

Lovely to talk to you.

Well, as I said, a lot of high-profile execs are going to be called before this inquiry. I mean, what do you hope to get out of them?

McIntosh

I think on behalf of all Australians, my answer to that would be answers. It's been disastrous from the very beginning, as we know. Lives were lost and there's nothing more serious than when something like the Triple Zero outage occurred and people did die. And both Optus and the government haven't given transparency. I met with the CEO, he indicated to me that they believe it's human error. How does human error result in something so disastrous. And then we've got the government who's been too slow and too distracted. And now I'm so pleased that we do have this Senate inquiry because Optus needs to come forward and give Australians answers and to give Australians reassurances that this will never happen again.

Webster

You know, Melissa, people keep telling me it can't be the case and I'm wondering in this modern day of technology why it can't be the case. And it can be in some circumstances so that when you dial Triple Zero, it doesn't matter what the telco is, you'll get through that, the call will get through and I can't understand why that can't happen. As the shadow, do you know why that can't happen?

McIntosh

It should have happened. And that was, that's one of the questions it should have. It's called camping-on in technical terms.

Webster

Yeah.

McIntosh

So, if they called Optus and Telstra should have picked it up another provider. But there was such a catastrophic failure that on this occasion that didn't occur. But it's not just about this one-off event. There's been other telcos that have had Triple Zero outages and other things going on. So, although Optus is really, you know, the pressure is on them right now we should be looking at the whole system. I think it's broken. I don't have a whole lot of confidence that if we continue down this trajectory that Australians won't be experiencing these outages multiple times over and over again. That's just not good enough. People pay money to be customers. But more than that, when it's Triple Zero, their lives are reliant on an efficient service.

Webster

Yeah.

McIntosh

So, let's get to the bottom of it. ACMA, which is the regulator, is appearing today as well. I don't think ACMA has been doing the right thing either they're caught up in the process. Optus alerted ACMA, the regulator, of the outage on the Thursday. The Minister for Communication, saying she didn't know about it until the Friday. So there's this big …

Webster

Oh, yeah.

McIntosh

Question mark around transparency there. But now the Minister's appointed ACMA to investigate. So essentially they're investigating themselves. Well, that's just not on either.

Webster

Yeah, disaster all round. So, I'm hoping, and I think my listeners are probably hoping this will be a pretty tough line of questioning today.

McIntosh

Yeah, let's make it tough. I think they deserve it. We don't have the answers, and I think Australians deserve to have answers that this won't occur again. And I encourage people to come forward to be part of this inquiry if they can. I would like it to be as deep as possible because what's the point if we don't get some answers out of this and it's just another bureaucratic exercise and right now, approaching disaster season, we need to ensure that every government lever, everything is being done to protect Australians in their greatest time of need. That's what this is about.

Webster

Yeah. You know, I live in a part of Sydney that I've got to use and it's the only way I can get telecommunications or communications, full stop - Starlink and, and I've still got, I have to say, I keep saying to the listeners I'm going to investigate, maybe steering away from them. I've got wi-fi calling with Optus now.

If that goes down, we're in trouble, even, you know, close to Sydney. But I really feel for people in the regions with this - with telecommunications in the, you know, far west of New South Wales, wherever it may be, up in the Pilbara where communications are tough. It's about public trust, Melissa, in that Triple Zero system, isn't it?

McIntosh

It is about public trust. And I've been working with Anne Webster, my Nationals colleague and she's been, you know, she's appointed to look after the regions and she goes around the country to regional areas and this is what they are experiencing on a daily basis and that's not acceptable either. And if you've got Starlink – my - I hope it works out with the low orbiting satellites. But right now all of them are foreign owned.

Webster

Yeah, that's right.

McIntosh

Some Australian satellites in the sky for our own capability. I think that's essential. And I would like to see the call centres for Triple Zero not to be offshore. That's been part of the problem with this issue as well, that the call centres, people are calling the Optus Triple Zero call centre and they were being answered in another country.

Webster

Yeah.

McIntosh

So, let's look at whether we can have them in Australia and whether that's going to make a difference.

Webster

Yeah, well, just, yeah just going back to the personal thing, I couldn't agree with you more. I mean, Starlink is Elon Musk, but I don't - we don't have a choice because. And you know, we're only 85kms out of the CBD and in the street in which we live, there's no NBN and probably won't be in my lifetime and I've got to use that wi-fi calling because I can't get access. And we try, believe me, Telstra couldn't help me, any of the carriers couldn't help me. So, it had to be for us to get telecommunications, Starlink. And I'm not in the middle of the bush, I'm just on the outskirts of Sydney. So, I mean, can we investigate this in totality eventually and say to Australians, look, no matter where you live, no matter where you live, no matter who your provider is, where you're getting it from, in essence, this is the most serious thing you will have access to Triple Zero.

McIntosh

That is a great goal to have, and it shouldn't be just an ambition, it should be reality.

Webster

Yes.

McIntosh

I - one of the things I was pushing for was Triple Zero network, to be listed as critical infrastructure, to apply that next level of assurances in the capability of it. We haven't managed to get it through Parliament this stage, but perhaps in the future, because as you said, more technology is coming on. We have ageing infrastructure.

David Littleproud has told me about, like in the bush, where it's almost things that sticky tape together when it comes to some of the wires and things. And it's just - it shouldn't be on in like today's society in Australia. So, I hope we can get to a stage. It just requires a lot of focus and commitment and politicians and bureaucrats, and the companies all have to care about this issue.

Webster

Yeah.

McIntosh

So, let's get them caring. I think we need to keep the pressure on, not forget about it. As we all know, lives were lost and there's nothing more important than protecting Australian citizens.

Webster

Yeah. Could I just say this to you as well? And you know, this is in your ballpark. I mean, sometimes we have these inquiries and even Royal Commissions and recommendations are made and not carried out. And the most glaring at the moment is in the childcare sector. I mean, I worry, I think my listeners worry, and maybe you do too, that we have these inquiries in the Senate.

You call up every executive he can think of and, you know, maybe things down the track don't get done as they should get done. I mean, do we have any assurances that, well, after we grill all these people and get everyone up and say, well, you know, what are you going to do about this, that something will get done?

McIntosh

I really hope so. And you're right. I think this is where people start losing faith in the political system when people feel like they've had inquiry upon inquiry and bureaucrats and politicians are kept in their jobs doing this, but nothing seems to come of it. I think on this Optus one, as long as we can keep the pressure on, we have to make it.

Webster

Yeah.

McIntosh

It doesn't happen by itself. We have to make sure that there are significant outcomes. I'm concerned the government sat on recommendations from the Bean Review after the 2023 Optus outage for a year and a half and a half …

Webster

Yeah, exactly.

McIntosh

And we still don't know which recommendations have been implemented. So, you're right to ask that question, but it takes passionate people to want to enforce an outcome, really. But on this one, let's hope that we get some pragmatic, practical solutions that can be implemented really quickly before, even before disaster season.

Webster

Yeah, good on you. Give it to them, hey?

McIntosh

Yep, got to do that.

Webster

Yeah, well, yeah, I mean, that's channeling Don Chip: keep the bastards honest.

McIntosh

I know.

Webster

Exactly. Yeah.

McIntosh

I didn't think at this time in the morning that would be appropriate.

Webster

No, it's fine, it's fine. You can say that on our show. Well, I did. You didn't have to worry.

McIntosh

Yeah, okay.

Webster

Thanks for your time. It's good to talk to you. Thanks.

McIntosh

Thank you. Bye.