Sunday Agenda - 14 December 2025

Melissa McIntosh MP
Shadow Minister for Communications
Shadow Minister for Women
Federal Member for Lindsay

Sunday, 14 December

Transcript

Sunday Agenda

Topics: Expenses; Ministerial code of conduct; Social media ban; More support into youth mental health; Energy rebates discontinued; Budget deficit; Batteries announcement; Tomago.

E&OE ….

Andrew Clennell

Joining me live in the studio, Shadow Communications Minister Melissa McIntosh. Thanks for your time. Thank you. Let's start with your reaction to this big news I've broken this morning. Michelle Rowland, the Attorney-General, has to pay back a portion of the cost of her family holiday in Perth, initially to involve work. This is to me is pretty significant. Others in past governments have had to resign over this sort of thing. What's your view?

Melissa McIntosh

Well my view is that the Prime Minister should have stepped up when he had the invitation from the Opposition Leader to sit down and review what's going on. You have the IPEA standards, which we all have to adhere to, but as a Minister of the Crown, you have additional standards when it comes to your parliamentary, your ministerial code of conduct. And it is clear here that she needs to be referred by the Prime Minister to Prime Minister and Cabinet for a thorough investigation.

Andrew Clennell

What's the test for resigning, do you think? She's the first law officer. She's been found to have breached the rules. She took her family for a holiday business class to Perth. Do you think any sort of investigation review on the ministerial code would see her go?

Melissa McIntosh

I think it will be up to the Prime Minister to have that investigation into PM&C and see, as you said, it's just breaking. But when you're a minister...

Andrew Clennell

What if he doesn't?

Melissa McIntosh

Well, he's accountable to the Australian public, I think, on this. Why have a code? Why have a ministerial code, if you're not expecting your most senior ministers to be adhering to it?

Andrew Clennell

And what about Anika Wells? Do you think she'll have to pay money back?

Melissa McIntosh

Well, she's going through the IPEA process and, as I've said to you, I went and worked with IPEA prior to my trip and I went through that process that ensured that I was within the rules and got the tick off. So, she needs to go through that process if she's not in the rules, she has to also be referred to Prime Minister and Cabinet.

Andrew Clennell

Well, you know my view on that; we strongly disagree. I don't think you should have gone on that trip with your son. You went economy, but you know, you still defend that trip. You don't feel any...

Melissa McIntosh

Yeah, absolutely.

Andrew Clennell

You did official business there, as far as you're concerned.

Melissa McIntosh

As I've said, I was there for four days, visited a number of colleagues, saved the taxpayers money by not taking a staff member. Byron essentially worked for me, took all my photos.

Andrew Clennell

How many meetings did you have there?

Melissa McIntosh

I spent a whole day on mental health with Karen, and then I spent another day with two other colleagues and then another day with another colleague.

Andrew Clennell

Meeting other people than your colleagues?

Melissa McIntosh

Yes, as Shadow Minister for Mental Health, meeting youth mental health advocates, going to Headspace, all those types of organisations.

Andrew Clennell

You would have heard me report this morning the PM's likely to receive a report on family reunion travel this week. We know Cabinet's tomorrow. He lent into it it then. I wonder if it's tomorrow. And that he'll act on these recommendations. So I can see the changes coming here. I mean, because the government's bleeding. They're bleeding again this morning on it. Would you support changes and a shake-up?

Melissa McIntosh

I think there has to be changes. There's a public expectation, and you just need to listen to people right across the country that are pretty unhappy right now. But I hope the Prime Minister includes the opposition in that. And Sussan, you know, had that invite open. He's dismissed it. He hasn't responded to her directly. But I think that's important because it does cover every single member of Parliament.

Andrew Clennell

Phil Thompson agreed to pay money back yesterday. I mean, it's a bit of a pox on both houses, is it? Or do you think people view the government worse on this?

Melissa McIntosh

I think, I don't know the case with Phil at all until you just told me. But I think it's this excessive use of taxpayers' money for big events. And it started with the trip to New York and the $1,000 dinner that the minister said she fell asleep in. So, I think it's when it goes above and beyond, and people don't think that attending sporting events with your husband coming down just for that event, you know, is work. So, yeah, there's an expectation that it's been broken with Australian people.

Andrew Clennell

Well, we've seen this card that you put out, the Liberal Party's putting out in her seat, Anika Wells' seat of Lily. I wonder if we can get that on screen. It's pretty devastating. It says, ‘Wish you were here,’ and then it says, as you're dealing with inflation and, you know, power prices and interest rates, and then it's got a photo of all of Anika Wells' trips and then it's got a list of them. Thanks for contributing to this. I mean, you've nailed it there, haven't you?

Melissa McIntosh

Well, I think, imagine if the shoe was on the other foot, I think Labor would be making the most of it. I've just seen that now. This is what people, when I'm saying extensive or excessive use, it's not just one, it is multiple occasions, and that's why she should have an investigation as well. And the Prime Minister needs to step up on this. He said that he's just following the rules, yet we've heard that the rules were changed just before the last election. And he should have...

Andrew Clennell

In terms of party political events, benefiting your side as well, presumably.

Melissa McIntosh

Well, we're just becoming aware that this...

Andrew Clennell

Did your side know about it?

Melissa McIntosh

No, well, that's the first I've heard about it. And it was a change by the senator who... But the Prime Minister saying it's separate and it needs to stay impartial, well it shows that it's not. And now he needs to show the Australian people he's serious about making change.

Andrew Clennell

Let's talk about the social media ban. Anecdotally, I'm certainly hearing a lot about its lack of effectiveness. What are you hearing?

Melissa McIntosh

Well, it's exactly what I warned. Kids were already migrating across to social media platforms that weren't caught up in the ban, and we all want to protect Australian children, but it was this rushed rollout. And I actually think the Minister for Communications’ lack of attention to detail and interest in PR’ing something before it was even successful - so a rushed rollout, they set the date, platforms were being drip fed in. We're hearing that digital ID, people could be compelled and however you feel about showing your driver's license or your birth certificate, this data is being stored in an offshore data centre. And what are the protections around very private information? So I think the direction towards failure seems to be getting stronger and stronger, and that's not what we want for Australian kids.

Andrew Clennell

The government says it's a success, but just because we're having a conversation about it. What do you make of that?

Melissa McIntosh

That isn't evidence-based policy making, is it? Oh, it's success because the vibe is good and we're all having a chat. This is very important legislation that we all put through Parliament. The Prime Minister is promoting it to the world as ‘look at Australia’, but we're a leader in having good conversations? That doesn't make sense. There needs to be a measure of success, and the Minister and the Prime Minister are unable to say what that is.

Andrew Clennell

If kids aren't being kicked off, of course it could not, maybe not the fault of the government, the fault of the companies. The government's promised to levy fines on the companies. Do you think the way things stand, it's inevitable that will occur if the government is taking the ban seriously?

Melissa McIntosh

Well, I think they should be applying those fines if they're taking it seriously. But if they can't say what constitutes success, it's a difficult one. There are many faults here. I would love to spend time to talk about the lack of investment in youth mental health. So you're kicking all these kids off. They're really upset. Psychologists are declaring that kids are going to have mental health issues. There's no investment from the government.

Andrew Clennell

So you'd like to see some psychology visits and the like funded extra to cope with it?

Melissa McIntosh

Yeah, or investment into some of these youth mental health services, particularly around this. But the government's, again, big PR exercise, lack of detail.

Andrew Clennell

Ted O'Brien's in the US having a nice holiday while we're here, Melissa McIntosh. I mean, it's my MYEFO week. That's not ideal, is it?

Melissa McIntosh

I don't know the personal nature of Ted's visit, but he's a pretty straight guy when it comes to, you know, doing his job well. So I'm sure there's a very valid reason. I heard it's around being with his family and that's fair enough.

Andrew Clennell

Yeah, but is he serious as Shadow Treasurer? I mean we're always, all of us are away from family for work. I mean is he serious as a Shadow Treasurer if he's not fronting up for the mid-year economic statement? What next, he's going to skip the Budget?

Melissa McIntosh

No, I hardly think that. He's been really strong in prosecuting against the Treasurer and their big spending. You know, Australians are doing it tougher than they ever have, and the Treasurer, I even just heard him there today, still declaring the blame on everyone else but themselves for breaking that $275 promise that they made Australians. And I'm sure Australians haven't forgotten, and Ted's been a strong prosecutor of that very point. So I don't have any issues with him not being here right now.

Andrew Clennell

What did you make of the batteries change yesterday?

Melissa McIntosh

It's really perplexing. So the government spent all this money on battery subsidies, but now because of their failed rollout yet again, they're having to spend $5 billion more because people were, a smaller number of people were spending a lot more money on getting big batteries they didn't need. So once again, this is a rushed policy by the government. And I know in my community that people do want to do the right thing. We have a high uptake in solar, but they they still can't afford the batteries even with these subsidies. So yet again, a big spending government lacking detail and Australians are paying for it.

Andrew Clennell

He was talking up $20 billion in savings…

Melissa McIntosh

I’d like to see that!

Andrew Clennell

… But he wouldn't say it's lowered deficits.

Melissa McIntosh

No, and he also couldn't tell you where those savings were going to be.

Andrew Clennell

Oh, he mentioned a couple of things.

Melissa McIntosh

Well, Labor's spending to GDP is going up and up. They promised Australians, I heard the Treasurer there declaring how great it is and how strong they're doing, but you go walk out on any high street of any suburb across the country where people are barely putting food on the table, I can't see how they're thinking that they've never had it any better than what this government's trying to tell them.

Andrew Clennell

What did you make of the government announcement on Friday re-guaranteeing Tomago the aluminium smelter will keep going?

Melissa McIntosh

Yeah, well, this is again a lack of detail in how much that's going to cost, and why did we get here. I know I've spent time with one of our country's biggest companies that produce steel and their energy prices were so high our country's largest foundry was at risk of going offshore. These are companies that produce products for manufacturing in defence industries. So it's also about our sovereign capabilities. So these big manufacturing, heavy industries, they're dying across our country, and they can't just keep getting propped up by the government because the energy prices are so high because of their complete focus on renewables only. What are we going to have left when we don't have a smelter or we don't have a foundry in this country?

Andrew Clennell

Melissa McIntosh, thank you for your time.

Melissa McIntosh

Thank you.

[ENDS]