4BC with Gary Hardgrave - 26 January 2026

Melissa McIntosh MP 
Shadow Minister for Communications 
Shadow Minister for Women 
Federal Member for Lindsay 

26 January 2026 

Transcript 

4BC with Gary Hardgrave

Topics: ABC Always Was Tonight program, Liberal Party.

E&EO … 

Gary Hardgrave:

The Shadow Communications Minister has hit out at some broadcasting, Australian Broadcasting Corporation program called Always Was Tonight. Apparently, it aired last Tuesday night, all before the National Day of Mourning last week included a segment with some indigenous kids wearing white hoods and a logo chanting Triple J to Triple K. That is disgusting. I mean, seriously divisive rubbish phrases such as celebrating Australia is by taking the hood to the hood. The Shadow Communications Minister, Melissa McIntosh, joins me now. Come on, Melissa McIntosh, just tell us you're going to defund this thing if you ever get back into government. It's awful.

Melissa McIntosh:

Let me start on a positive and say happy Australia Day to you and your listeners. I think some music's really great. I know it's out of your area, but I was just at Panthers, we had a band and it's bringing people together and just seeing people have a good time on Australia Day. You've got to remember that's what it’s about, Australians celebrating Australia. And you're right on the ABC, I think it was - probably the words I would want to say, I can't say in your radio program, but it's really distasteful. Having kids, first and foremost, with white hoods over their heads. Triple J, as you said to KKK, and we all know what that is. The national broadcaster is meant to be the national broadcaster, and if there's a time when it shouldn't be divisive, it's right now. So I've had a go at them before, last year it was all about Invasion Day for the ABC and there was not one mention on the day before Australia Day about Australia Day.

Gary Hardgrave:

Well, I mean, as I said, they're very popular music network, Triple J. They don't do the Australian top 100 on Australia Day, they do it days before and then they feature international artists. I mean, I know that might seem a ridiculous example, but here's another one for you. On the National Day of Mourning, Thursday, which was a very sad, poignant moment, this radio station is part of a network of four in Sydney, Melbourne and Perth. We followed the instructions, we followed the sentiment of 7:01pm Sydney time. That was what we were instructed. So in Brisbane, it was 6.01pm In Perth, it was 4.01pm The ABC didn't want to interrupt their programming, it just kept running recorded bits and bobs and everybody stopped in different time zones. That wasn't a national day, it was a segregated kind of time of mourning. I mean, they just don't do the Australian thing anymore Melissa.

Melissa McIntosh:

Yeah, and that, I think, is why People are getting fed up, if they haven't already been fed up. Disgruntled about the ABC and question the appropriate use of their taxpayer money, and it's right for people to question it. I've had concerns about fair and balanced journalism. I've had concerns now about these sorts of issues. I want us to have a good ABC. I think it's important in rural areas and it's important to have a public broadcaster, but they’re either stretching the boundaries of their charter or they're completely just not adhering to them and I'd like us first and foremost, and I know your listeners would love to say I would defund the ABC and I can't say that, but I would like to have a look at their charter, I really would, and see if it's fit for purpose - and it is doing what it should be doing for the Australian people.

Gary Hardgrave:

Well, I think things have changed, 30 years in a couple of weeks time since I was elected to the Federal Parliament. I was secretary of the Howard Government's Communications Policy Subcommittee. So, I looked very closely at all of this stuff, Melissa, and I'm happy to chat to you about it offline. But the thing that's changed in 30 years is technology. So people in rural and regional Australia are getting access to all of the range of voices they want. So they're listening to 4BC on a streaming app in Far North Queensland, outside of our broadcast area. They're listening to radio stations in all around the world. Wherever they want, they can pick and choose their media. I think the concept of a national broadcaster has reached its use by date. Make it a subscription service. If you want it, you pay. If you don't, you don't have to listen to it.

Melissa McIntosh:

Yeah, I'm hearing that point expressed quite often about the subscription side of things. I think it really has, and I would love to speak to you more. It really has gotten to a point where Australians have lost trust in the public broadcaster to give them that fair and balanced reporting, which is what most of those journalists would have learned when they learned about journalism, to be fair and balanced, and that's not coming across. I've raised this with the chairman of the ABC directly and he's tried to give me the argument, well, it's fair and balanced across all their programs. I'm like, well, you can't really count Bluey, you know, against a news program that's not really on. So, it's a bit too tricky for Australians liking. And this one, you know, sort of topped it for me around having young kids in white hoods and Triple J changed to KKK, and then it was meant to be a comedy show that everyone was just meant to laugh about and dismiss. Well, that's not on.

Gary Hardgrave:

There's always a fine line between funny and offensive in comedy. You've got to be careful. But they have crossed the line. The other thing that struck me is that there seems to be a view in this balancing thing, Melissa McIntosh, where we go to the extreme over there, so we go to the extreme over on the other side and now we're balanced. It does actually work, if you get what I mean, outrigger to the canoe thing. But surely where's the middle ground? Where's the unifying statement? The Prime Minister has three different flags he has standing behind him every time he speaks. We have this division now being sowed by major institutes – universities, we're seeing it in schools, we're certainly seeing it on this taxpayer funded broadcaster and telecaster. We need to get the unity task at work I think.

Melissa McIntosh:

I think it's the time too, and I think Australians had their say on the division that was caused around the Voice and the referendum, that we don't want divisiveness. We voted no, in my electorate it was really high - 70% no. And across the country, with the majority of Australians not wanting that. But it doesn't seem like a lot of media outlets have got that message and nor the Prime Minister, with the way that his behaviour has been over the last month or so since Bondi, and even before that. I think people want and we need hope and optimism and we need unity in our country, I think that's really important and that’s why I went out today in my community, just to see how people were feeling and people just want to be happy and they want to live their lives.

Gary Hardgrave:

Yeah, they do.

Melissa McIntosh:

And they don't want all of this going on.

Gary Hardgrave:

I know. And the hard part for me is you call it out because you see it and you say, this is rubbish. I got to call it out, but here's how we bring all Australians of all backgrounds and beliefs. Everybody doesn't have to be like me and you, bluey, you know, bleeding blue. We can have different political views, different religious traditions, different cultural imperatives, but we've got to be challenging ourselves to be Australians and be that for Australia.

Melissa McIntosh:

Yeah, and have those values and remember how good it is to have such a strong democracy, that we have and to not take that for granted.

Gary Hardgrave:

No doubt about it. So, Invasion Day protests, I guess the good people in Western Sydney in and around Penrith. They wouldn't be overly excited about any of that rubbish. We had somebody burn an Australian flag here in Brisbane. I mean, it turns my stomach because I'm loudly, proudly Australian, but I'm also so confident that I can actually engage with other people. I mean, we even allow another country to use part of our flag as their entire flag. I mean, how Australian is that? We let Britain use a bit of our flag for their flag. Yeah, but, you know, you're a member. You're a member of the Federal Parliamentary Liberal Party. The Coalition's in absolute chaos. Things have got to be. Surely that ship's got to be right, not now but got to be corrected. Because voter confidence is just going to continue to ebb away from you guys. Can I ask about that?

Melissa McIntosh:

Yeah, of course. I just want to say one quick thing. We tried, when all the bills were going through Parliament last week, we tried to move an amendment where it would be against the law to burn the Australian flag. Phil Thompson, a good Queenslander, you know, had a private member's bill on that. I think that would have been a really decent thing to not be able to burn the flag. But on the Liberal Party, people are hating that we're talking about ourselves constantly. And we had a bad election, as we all know, and it would have been good for us to get back together and focus on the Australian people, because not once in the last few weeks have we talked about cost of living and how much people are struggling, or the pressures of immigration on housing and infrastructure and our hospitals and our schools. We're talking about who's going to be the next leader of the Liberal Party and what's going on with the Coalition. But we should not be talking about these things. You're right, I really hope we get to a point quicker rather than later, because every day that we miss, we're a day closer to the next election.

Gary Hardgrave:

Ok, so numbers could be tested in coming days some say. Are you going to be part of that mix? Can you play a formal leadership role? Not just simply as a senior Shadow Minister?

Melissa McIntosh:

I've said pretty openly I would love to be the leader of our party in our country. I love our country dearly. I want people to have a better life for themselves and their families. I’ve also said that that doesn't mean it's now. There's no phone calls that been made to me at the moment or that I'm hearing that people are making. I think there's a lot of carry on in the media about the leadership spill. I would prefer that we tried to get back on track and not have all this division. But sometimes these things, as you know very much, can get a life of their own. So right now, I'm not hearing anything.

Gary Hardgrave:

All right, Melissa, you stay in touch with us. Great to talk to you again. Melissa McIntosh. She's Shadow Communications Minister, Member for Lindsay Western Sydney.