Transcript - ABC Radio Melbourne Mornings - 8 October 2025

Melissa McIntosh MP
Shadow Minister for Communications
Shadow Minister for Women
Federal Member for Lindsay

8 October 2025

Transcript

ABC Radio Melbourne with Rafael Epstein.

Topics: Triple Zero outage; Triple Zero inquiry; Social media age minimum.

E&EO …

Rafael Epstein

There were issues with Optus at the end of ‘23, there were issues with Telstra in ‘24, the Federal government was told you need a Triple Zero custodian. The questions came thick and fast yesterday in Parliament. Melissa McIntosh joins you; she is the Shadow Communications Minister. Good morning.

Melissa McIntosh

Good morning.

Rafael Epstein

Do you think Optus has lost the right to operate in Australia?

Melissa McIntosh

No, I certainly think they've lost confidence. The Australians have lost confidence in them, in their CEO, and in addition to that, the government. Four people have died. You've got to remember the seriousness of this issue. It's not a political issue; it's about life and death. When somebody is in need they should be able to pick up the phone and call Triple Zero, and that failed, and four people are no longer here. So, I think it's worth putting the pressure on Optus to answer the questions they have. Have the independent investigation which I've been calling for for weeks now, not run by ACMA, the regulator as they are part of the failed process, and I'm also calling on a number of amendments today in the legislation that the government's rushed through at the end of Parliament for the year. They've been sitting on recommendations after the first Optus outage in 2023 for a year and a half and now we get to the end of Parliament and they're rushing through this legislation and expect the Coalition just to jump on board.

Rafael Epstein

I'm happy to come to the government in a moment. On companies themselves, rules and laws can always be ignored, right? You can have the toughest regulator, you can have the toughest laws. If a phone company doesn't do the right thing, we're stuffed. So, isn't it always up to the phone companies to do the right thing?

Melissa McIntosh

Of course they should be doing the right thing, especially when it's one of our most essential telecommunications services. There's an expectation of Australians, it's not just making a call to your mate and you can't make it, just to say hello how's your weekend been? This is when people are in a serious condition, and they need triple zero and they need that phone to be answered. And there is a responsibility by telecommunications companies, and they need to ensure that their systems are fit for purpose. I know that I'm hearing from telco companies that the emergence of mobile phones has caused issues in their systems and all the changes in technology. Well, that doesn't matter. You've got to get with it. You've got to keep up to date, you've got to be investing in your company and investing in your customers’ welfare.

Rafael Epstein

You said you've been calling for a more independent investigation for weeks now.

Melissa McIntosh

Yes.

Rafael Epstein

Why didn't you make noise about this before the Optus outage? Why weren't you talking about the Triple Zero custodian before there were problems last month with Optus?

Melissa McIntosh

So, it's on me as the Opposition to be doing this when the government sat on recommendations for a year and a half? I had been asking for an incoming briefing for weeks and weeks from the Minister, of her Department, and it only came a couple of weeks ago.

Rafael Epstein

You don't need a briefing to know there's problems. You don't need a briefing to know there's problems with Triple Zero.

Melissa McIntosh

Well, you need a briefing to get across the details of the government's responsibility. So, I think that's pretty clear.

Rafael Epstein

The Bean Review was published 18 months ago, that's been your point, right?

Melissa McIntosh

Yeah, and it's the government's responsibility to implement the recommendations. And we didn't know until yesterday in Parliament because the Minister did not make it clear to anyone in the public that they've actually had a Custodian in the Department since March. Well, what's that Custodian been doing? Even the people that were on the committee to form the custodian were unaware of what the custodian was doing. So, I think the question should come to the government. If the Custodian's there, been there since March, why are we just getting the legislation through now? To give it the powers it needs to oversee Triple Zero.

Rafael Epstein

That Triple Zero custodian, it does seem to be really important. It's someone keeping an eye on the whole system. However, you haven't mentioned the Triple Zero Custodian. I can't find a transcript or a press release from the Opposition. I think it's a really valid point that the government hasn't done anything about this, but I can't find anyone in the Opposition talking about the Triple Zero Custodian for the last 18 months. So, it's on you as well, isn't it?

Melissa McIntosh

I've certainly been calling for the full recommendations, including the Custodian, since the Triple Zero outage. I have been in this role since just before the election and doing everything I can right now to ensure the government is using every single lever to protect Australians.

Rafael Epstein

So, it's not that you've been busy fighting with each other too much?

Melissa McIntosh

I think our most important role is to be a strong Opposition and that's why I've been really focused on holding the government and Optus to account since this outage, because I think it's important. We can't be bickering or focusing on ourselves. Australians rejected us at the last election, and they don't want to see us behaving in a way that looks like we're just thinking about ourselves. So, I think this is an important policy area because it is about protecting Australians and there's no more important job for a government and in fact an Opposition, than to protect our citizens.

Rafael Epstein

Melissa McIntosh is the Shadow Communications Minister. She's part of Sussan Ley’s Opposition. The phone number is 1300 222 774. Melissa McIntosh, there is a social media ban that I want to get to, but do you trust that the telcos now understand what they have to do?

Melissa McIntosh

I asked for a meeting with all the telco CEOs. Optus offered me the government relations manager. I asked twice of Optus. So, the Optus CEO was here yesterday, didn't meet with me. Telstra declined, offered me the government relations manager. But TPG, the CEO, did meet with me and they indicated that this outage has reinforced the importance of the robustness of their system. So, I think it has.

Rafael Epstein

Do you believe them? Do you think it has?

Melissa McIntosh

Well, you would hope so, because we need to have trust in our Triple Zero network. If Australians start losing trust in that, we're in real trouble and they have a responsibility to ensure that it is working efficiently. And we did talk about the importance of ensuring the networks fit for purpose approaching the disaster season in summer, and that people in regional Australia have access where it's really bad at times. So, I think they are, they need to really move along very quickly - some of it's very technical - and I hope the legislation that's coming through the Parliament right now isn't just a bureaucracy for bureaucracy's sake or the government doing what it thinks it needs to do for political purposes. And that's why I'll be moving some amendments this morning as well.

Rafael Epstein

I just want to ask you again, because you use the words ‘hope’, you hope the telcos get it. Do you trust that they do?

Melissa McIntosh

They have to get it right. They have to get it right. And trust is a difficult thing to maintain. Of course, trust can be jolted and it's surely jolted my trust in them. That's why I've been putting so much pressure on, these last few weeks. They need to earn people's trust. These aren't just their customers, these are Australians and it's around Australians’ lives. As I said, Triple Zero is our most essential service and it needs to be in the best shape possible.

Rafael Epstein

Melissa McIntosh, as the Shadow Communications Minister, you know a lot more, I guess, than most people listening about the social media ban that is coming. Platforms like Twitch, Roblox, Discord, WhatsApp, that kids use to learn and message each other, they are all going to be included in that social media ban. Does the Opposition support that broad a ban?

Melissa McIntosh

I want this to work for the kids of Australia. I think that if there is a ban, I'm sceptical right now that it's going to work, but the government's telling everyone it is. We need to have ensured that every platform that kids could be exposed to bullying or inappropriate content is included, but that's up to the eSafety Commissioner and it's not quite clear right now which platform's in and out and parents need to have that reassurance.

Rafael Epstein

Sorry to interrupt, but are you sceptical of the government? Are you sceptical of the tech companies? Do you think children will get around it? What's the source of your scepticism?

Melissa McIntosh

Probably all of the above. For your listeners that have children, they know, even if you're the most attentive parent they can find a way. And we want to ensure that the technology, the verification of age technology, is working effectively and we want to make sure that the government's doing everything it can to protect Australian children. So, the ban's coming, it's got a deadline now. Let's see how it goes. But I do have question marks just with the process that has been going on. It's all well and good to say, we're very focused on children, but there's a lot behind that to get this right.

Rafael Epstein

Thanks so much for your time. Really appreciate it.

Melissa McIntosh

Thank you.